Awkward Utopia

This week’s discussion was unusually meandering. We began with announcements (to include the long-awated revelation by UES elder Matt Masten that he will be pursuing his graduate education at Northwestern University) and officer nominations. After (finally) pinning down our end-of-semester banquet locale (it will be Thursday of reading week, if anyone is wondering, at Merlion Restaurant, 6 o’clock p.m.), we began with the question: Are property rights human rights?

MM: No human rights exist in nature.

CW: If there are human rights, then property rights are one of them. The Declaration of Independence mentions inalienable rights, and property rights should be among them. Except for intellectualy property rights, which should be abolished.

BL: Locke said man has certain properties: life, liberty, and estate.

VR: Considering God has not spoken to us…

[General discontentious uproar]

VR: …we have no proof that we have rights to property, so I think anybody can take anything from anyone at any time.

Bryan W: It wouldn’t matter what God said if he could not enforce it.

Juan: Products of your labor belong to you.

JN: The essay question asked why property rights have fewer champions than human rights. Do they? I don’t necessarily think so. Even recently, you have people (eg. DeSoto) listing property rights as essential to human welfare.

VR: Isn’t taxation a violation of that right, then?

CW: That’s different. There is a little-known statute that allows someone in another country to sue someone else in American courts. It was originally meant to be used against, say, pirates, but now people are wanting to use it to protect labor rights (the right to organize, etc.).

BL: As for why there are fewer advocates, it’s that the intelligentsia is dominated by the left-wing and property rights get in the way of government intervention. They embody the idea that a person can do what he pleases, and people find that to be a problem.

MM: Consider markets for organs.  Hamermesh said that they’re repugnant and that alone prevents them from occurring. That’s somewhat Freudian: because he is repulsed he assumes other people are too. That’s an example of what BL was saying.

Matt H: Without ownership, there is no incentive for anyone to do anything. We need property rights.

CW agrees: Every society that’s ever tried to abrogate them has failed.

MM: Well, the extreme lack of property rights was the cause of the failure of communism. But for us it’s a marginal decision. A little more (ie. the right to sell our organs) or a little less. Everyone agrees property rights are a good thing, the question is, how much?

CW: I want to talk about Obama.

VR: Okay, new question. Do people in small towns cling to their guns?

BW: In my experience, having family in West Virgina, the answer is yes, they do.

CW: I like Obama as a person and I think the campaign is bringing him down. But what I want to talk about is this: he wants to ban all toys from China because of liability issues and such. He has safety in mind, but it will increase prices.

Juliana: I didn’t used to believe it, but I worked at a party store and there were always recals.

BL: I voted for Obama in the primary, but he is a politician, and this is a handout to the manufacturing lobby. Recalled toys are an infinitesimal part of the trade we do with China.

Juan: Is anybody else offended that Bill Clinton passed NAFTA and now Hillary’s against it?

CW: No, my problem is that she was for it, and even though all the evidence shows it’s a great thing, now she changes her stance.

Juan: Bush wants to eliminated farm subsidies and the Democrats are trying to stop him. It’s hypocrisy.

CW: I’m fair and balanced because I’m a Republican. McCain is not much better. He mocked Romney for making profit. I think we’re gonna see lots of populist talk during this election cycle. We’re debating trade with Columbia. It’s similar to CAFTA which opened their markets to our stuff. Getting rid of subsidies would actually benefit those countries; subsidies are destroying everyone’s economies.

Juan: It hurts American small farmers also.

VR interjects: UES T-shirt designs are in!

Daniel: I heard something about, our soil can’t handle all this farming. That’s a whole other problem with subsidies.

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“They say a good man can’t get elected President. I don’t believe that.” Leo McGarry, The West Wing